OLD HOCKEY LEAGUE
Thank you for using the VGHL Forums

For NEW PLAYERS interested in joining the VGHL, please make sure that your FORUM NAME matches your PSN name then go to PLAYER REGISTRATION thread and follow the instructions there to join.
Enjoy

Please login to access our forum
EVENTS
We have a new site
CLICK HERE TO SIGN UP

Coming
October 2015


the return of the
VGHL!!

S10 will be on PS4




RIP #22
STAY CONNECTED
                          
(e)SPORTS TELEVISION NETWORK
MY VIRTUAL GAMING
VGHL AFTERDARK
VGGM CONNECTED

You are not connected. Please login or register

Definition of a tournament

Go to page : Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

Go down  Message [Page 2 of 3]

1Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 1:14 pm

ANason21


Veteran
Veteran
First topic message reminder :

you do know what single elimination means, right?


_________________
Season 7 PHL Vancouver Giants
Season 7 AHL Rockford Icehogs
Season 8 AHL Rochester Americans 'C'
Season 9 AHL Grand Rapids Griffins/NHL Detroit Redwings

26Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 2:44 pm

ANason21


Veteran
Veteran
kjdadada wrote:From that wiki page anason:

American professional team sports have a "regular season" (group tournament) acting as qualification for the "post season" or "playoffs" (single-elimination tournament)

Do you know what Wikipedia is?  why this page would say one thing ( American professional team sports)  and the stupid one you pasted (only NFL) says something else?  

Under your definition tennis or volleyball can NEVER have a single or double elimination tournament, yet every major tournament in their sports are considered as such. its common sense.  but, you did read it on wiki, so ...

I don't know, maybe the page that lists all the different types of tournaments instead of the one with one-offs about single-elimination tournaments. Perhaps I shouldn't have brought wikipedia into this, as it is always easy to find (or insert) conflicting information on there.

In any case, NBA, NHL, MLB have NEVER referred to their own playoffs as single-elimination tournaments. They are best-of-series elimination tournaments.

In tennis, even exhibitions are played in matches of multiple games and sets. No one has ever played one game and said okay, that's it. That's conventional, so why would their tournaments be any different? And if you lose a single match, you are out. Hence, single elimination.

In contrast, exhibition hockey games are only one game long. But NHL playoff tournament series are seven games long. You can lose up to three games in any series before being eliminated. Hence, not single elimination.

To be sure, and to further illustrate the difference, there do exist single-elimination hockey tournaments. Like the world juniors. They play a round-robin format to seed the playoff tournament, then play a single-elimination tournament to determine the winner. The Olympics and the World Cup (of Hockey) are the same way.

But if you are playing a series of hockey games to determine the winner of a tournament round, then you are by definition not playing a single-elimination tournament.

Have fun with your best-of-three elimination tournament. Sounds like it will be a blast.


_________________
Season 7 PHL Vancouver Giants
Season 7 AHL Rockford Icehogs
Season 8 AHL Rochester Americans 'C'
Season 9 AHL Grand Rapids Griffins/NHL Detroit Redwings

27Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 2:48 pm

kjdadada

kjdadada
Legend
Legend
ANason21 wrote:
In tennis, even exhibitions are played in matches of multiple games and sets. No one has ever played one game and said okay, that's it. That's conventional, so why would their tournaments be any different? And if you lose a single match, you are out. Hence, single elimination.

this is all I was looking for.

Explain to me in tennis how is a match winner decided?

Thanks.


_________________



2013

Season 5: Charlotte Checkers Captain
Season 6: New Jersey Devils G/RD
World Championship Admin | AHL Admin | Yanick Dupre Memorial Award (S5)

Thanks to KingFromTheDot for the sigs!

28Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 2:53 pm

kjdadada

kjdadada
Legend
Legend
in case you need help from your friend wiki:

" Traditionally, matches are either a best of three sets or best of five sets format"


_________________



2013

Season 5: Charlotte Checkers Captain
Season 6: New Jersey Devils G/RD
World Championship Admin | AHL Admin | Yanick Dupre Memorial Award (S5)

Thanks to KingFromTheDot for the sigs!

29Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 2:53 pm

ANason21


Veteran
Veteran
kjdadada wrote:
ANason21 wrote:
In tennis, even exhibitions are played in matches of multiple games and sets. No one has ever played one game and said okay, that's it. That's conventional, so why would their tournaments be any different? And if you lose a single match, you are out. Hence, single elimination.

this is all I was looking for.

Explain to me in tennis how is a match winner decided?

Thanks.

You're getting into semantics. It's a matter of nomenclature. No one goes to a tennis game. People go to tennis matches. When you buy a ticket to see Djokovic vs. Nadal, you know you will see a match, not just a game. Why would it be any different at a single-elimination tennis tournament?

People do, however, go to hockey games. So when you say a single-elimination hockey tournament, the expectation is that if a team loses one game, they're out.

Get it?


_________________
Season 7 PHL Vancouver Giants
Season 7 AHL Rockford Icehogs
Season 8 AHL Rochester Americans 'C'
Season 9 AHL Grand Rapids Griffins/NHL Detroit Redwings

30Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 2:55 pm

swiftDee52


Professional
Professional
Anason **** off. Dork. Everyone gets it. No one cares.

31Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 2:57 pm

ANason21


Veteran
Veteran
swiftDee52 wrote:Anason **** off. Dork. Everyone gets it. No one cares.

No, I'm pretty sure that kjdadada and kylej83 don't get it.


_________________
Season 7 PHL Vancouver Giants
Season 7 AHL Rockford Icehogs
Season 8 AHL Rochester Americans 'C'
Season 9 AHL Grand Rapids Griffins/NHL Detroit Redwings

32Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 3:03 pm

skizzzer


Professional
Professional
This is a stupid argument.

ANason21, you're right that wikipedia is not authoritative, because it's publicly sourced and publicly edited, but in that same article you're quoting from,

ANason21 wrote:

Not that wikipedia is authoritative, but it states that "Of the big four American sports leagues, only the National Football League uses [a single-elimination tournament] for its postseason."

Who needs to hit the books?

it states in the "best-of" section, "The "best-of" formats refers to a head-to-head competition where the two competitors compete to first win the majority of the games allotted to win the "series". If a competitor wins a majority of the games, the remaining games may be discarded. This is a modification of the single elimination tournament to allow more matches to be held."

In other words, a "best-of" series is a modified single elimination tournament.

If you go to the Wikipedia Single-elimination tournament page, Single-elimination tournaments are defined as "a type of elimination tournament where the loser of each bracket is immediately eliminated from winning the championship or first prize in the event."

The same page goes on to cite the final 3 rounds of the 2008 French Open - Women Singles for tennis as an example of a a Single-elimination tournament. Tennis, as we all know, consists of matches that are either played to a best-of 3 or best-of 5 games, depending on if it's men or women playing.

So if you want to be pedantic, this tournament is by definition a best-of 3, single elimination tournament. Note that "best-of 3" comes before "single elimination" because it is modifying the structure of the tournament.

As an aside, if you're looking for credible sources you're better off sticking to your post-secondary classes because who the fuck is going to write a research article on "The structural and semantic differences between "best-of" and "single-elimination" tournaments." Credible sources are important when you're referring to shit that matters, such as research papers, news, and apparently, online arguments on a hockey forum.

Fuck this stupid shit everyone knew what kj meant when he said single-elimination - you were just looking to start a fight. Thanks for wasting 5 minutes out of my precious, precious time at work.

33Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 3:06 pm

kjdadada

kjdadada
Legend
Legend
ok I got it now.

Tennis plays a best-of format to win a match. The loser of the MATCH is eliminated after one match loss. Thus a single-elimination tournament.

That is completely different then a best-of format to win a series. Where the loser of the SERIES is eliminated after one series loss. this is NOT a single-elimination tournament.

I get it.. I was just having fun with semantics, logic is fully on your side.


_________________



2013

Season 5: Charlotte Checkers Captain
Season 6: New Jersey Devils G/RD
World Championship Admin | AHL Admin | Yanick Dupre Memorial Award (S5)

Thanks to KingFromTheDot for the sigs!

34Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 3:07 pm

ANason21


Veteran
Veteran
skizzzer wrote:This is a stupid argument.

ANason21, you're right that wikipedia is not authoritative, because it's publicly sourced and publicly edited, but in that same article you're quoting from,

ANason21 wrote:

Not that wikipedia is authoritative, but it states that "Of the big four American sports leagues, only the National Football League uses [a single-elimination tournament] for its postseason."

Who needs to hit the books?

it states in the "best-of" section, "The "best-of" formats refers to a head-to-head competition where the two competitors compete to first win the majority of the games allotted to win the "series". If a competitor wins a majority of the games, the remaining games may be discarded. This is a modification of the single elimination tournament to allow more matches to be held."

In other words, a "best-of" series is a modified single elimination tournament.

If you go to the Wikipedia Single-elimination tournament page, Single-elimination tournaments are defined as "a type of elimination tournament where the loser of each bracket is immediately eliminated from winning the championship or first prize in the event."

The same page goes on to cite the final 3 rounds of the 2008 French Open - Women Singles for tennis as an example of a a Single-elimination tournament. Tennis, as we all know, consists of matches that are either played to a best-of 3 or best-of 5 games, depending on if it's men or women playing.

So if you want to be pedantic, this tournament is by definition a best-of 3, single elimination tournament. Note that "best-of 3" comes before "single elimination" because it is modifying the structure of the tournament.

As an aside, if you're looking for credible sources you're better off sticking to your post-secondary classes because who the fuck is going to write a research article on "The structural and semantic differences between "best-of" and "single-elimination" tournaments." Credible sources are important when you're referring to shit that matters, such as research papers, news, and apparently, online arguments on a hockey forum.

Fuck this stupid shit everyone knew what kj meant when he said single-elimination - you were just looking to start a fight. Thanks for wasting 5 minutes out of my precious, precious time at work.

What happens when you modify something? Does it stay the same or does it change? Just curious.


_________________
Season 7 PHL Vancouver Giants
Season 7 AHL Rockford Icehogs
Season 8 AHL Rochester Americans 'C'
Season 9 AHL Grand Rapids Griffins/NHL Detroit Redwings

35Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 3:08 pm

CastroGstar


Elite Legend
Elite Legend
The definition of double elimination means that you can lose once and still be eligible to compete.

If a win/loss is determined by a single game then once you lose one game you are still eligible to compete. If a win/loss is decided by a best of series then you could potentially lose one best of series and still be in the tournament.

Why is this so hard to understand?


_________________
Http://www.afterdarkent.ca

36Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 3:13 pm

kylej83

kylej83
Elite
Elite
ANason21 wrote:
I don't know, maybe the page that lists all the different types of tournaments instead of the one with one-offs about single-elimination tournaments. Perhaps I shouldn't have brought wikipedia into this, as it is always easy to find (or insert) conflicting information on there.

So I linked a wikipedia page that was removed shortly after. Funny.... I go to the wikipedia edits page, look at the IP, click on ANason21 on the VGHL forums, it's the same IP. scratch 

So you asked for a source which I provided, and then deleted that exact portion from the wikipedia page and claimed I grabbed it from some other website that nobody has heard of.

Well done sir.  lol! 


_________________
NHL Commissioner

Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Kyle_FA_v1_b1

#YSoHGaTET

37Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 3:21 pm

kjdadada

kjdadada
Legend
Legend
ANason21 wrote:Here's a more "authoratative" source for you fools:

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=900001&download=yes

The very first paragraph of the introduction distinguishes between single-elimination, double-elimination, and best-of-series tournaments.

But whatever, you kids know everything.

Sorry I moved the thread while you were digging for sources.. Yes, I told you that you were right which is why you obviously ignored my tennis post and found another source. And edit wiki pages.. I agree with Kyle. well played.


_________________



2013

Season 5: Charlotte Checkers Captain
Season 6: New Jersey Devils G/RD
World Championship Admin | AHL Admin | Yanick Dupre Memorial Award (S5)

Thanks to KingFromTheDot for the sigs!

38Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 3:26 pm

jmwalsh8888


Veteran
Veteran
CastroGstar wrote:The definition of double elimination means that you can lose once and still be eligible to compete.

If a win/loss is determined by a single game then once you lose one game you are still eligible to compete. If a win/loss is decided by a best of series then you could potentially lose one best of series and still be in the tournament.

Why is this so hard to understand?

it's not some people just like to argue for sake of arguing

39Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 3:26 pm

ANason21


Veteran
Veteran
kjdadada wrote:
ANason21 wrote:Here's a more "authoratative" source for you fools:

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=900001&download=yes

The very first paragraph of the introduction distinguishes between single-elimination, double-elimination, and best-of-series tournaments.

But whatever, you kids know everything.

Sorry I moved the thread while you were digging for sources..  Yes, I told you that you were right which is why you obviously ignored my tennis post and found another source.  And edit wiki pages.. I agree with Kyle. well played.

I didn't see your tennis post. I was responding to some of the other vitriol on here. Good talk, though.


_________________
Season 7 PHL Vancouver Giants
Season 7 AHL Rockford Icehogs
Season 8 AHL Rochester Americans 'C'
Season 9 AHL Grand Rapids Griffins/NHL Detroit Redwings

40Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 3:28 pm

kjdadada

kjdadada
Legend
Legend
lol. so. We agree it's a single elimination tournament that uses the best-of format? So your post asking me if I knew what that was, I was correct in saying yes.

Very good. I enjoyed it too.


_________________



2013

Season 5: Charlotte Checkers Captain
Season 6: New Jersey Devils G/RD
World Championship Admin | AHL Admin | Yanick Dupre Memorial Award (S5)

Thanks to KingFromTheDot for the sigs!

41Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 3:31 pm

ANason21


Veteran
Veteran
kjdadada wrote:lol.  so.  We agree it's a single elimination tournament that uses the best-of format?  So your post asking me if I knew what that was, I was correct in saying yes.  

Very good.  I enjoyed it too.

Do we really have to start this again? Rolling Eyes 


_________________
Season 7 PHL Vancouver Giants
Season 7 AHL Rockford Icehogs
Season 8 AHL Rochester Americans 'C'
Season 9 AHL Grand Rapids Griffins/NHL Detroit Redwings

42Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:02 pm

BARRYS_SNIPIN


Legend
Legend
you know this league is dying for some entertainment when your arguing about a format.. i didnt bother reading half this thread cuz it doesnt matter what the "term" is used.. hes taking his time to make a tournament and gets trolled hard.. if you dont wanna join it, ignore and move on.. although i like drama, this is stupid.. go drink some egg nog or fk up

43Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:18 pm

xYUCKOx

xYUCKOx
#YSoHGaTET
#YSoHGaTET
you are fucking joking with this topic right?

this is holiday fools right?


_________________
#YSoHGaTET
NHL Commissioner
VGHL World Champion
#61 - Yurij Bobkov - Defense
People I dislike the most: Kylej83
Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Yucko_nhl_com_v1_b1_zpsbpjieaoe
Vote Here!
http://yuck2blog.blog.com/

44Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:22 pm

PNCPark2k1

PNCPark2k1
Legend
Legend
CONGRATULATIONS! ... You guys are the proud creators of the dumbest "hot" thread of the week ....


_________________
Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Zzzz_w13

[5/30/2014 10:42:18 PM] PolymonC : Fucking delete it Kevin

[5/28/2014 10:35:16 PM] Kevin Woytkiw: All im gonna say is
[5/28/2014 10:35:24 PM] Kevin Woytkiw: Sp Pitt > Vg Dallas
[5/28/2014 10:35:26 PM] Kevin Woytkiw: gg

[6/15/2014 10:49:29 PM] Jay(PNCPark2k1) Hunt: Basically, and no offense, but you play 3s hockey
[6/15/2014 10:52:12 PM] ChiTownMenace (Capt. MIN VG): that wasnt one of our "cycling" lines

45Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:43 pm

skizzzer


Professional
Professional
ANason21 wrote:

What happens when you modify something? Does it stay the same or does it change? Just curious.

That's a good question. The only time I've modified a Wiki page was back in middle school where we had to write a book report on a book with no Wiki entry and edit it in. As far as I know anyone can make modifications/entries to a page. However, any edits, changes, and entries are reviewed by volunteers who will, if they deem it necessary, reverse the changes* - this can happen very quickly for popular pages, not so fast for unpopular pages. This is why Wiki is not viewed as a credible source for research, because ultimately the peer review process is run by a panel of volunteers who may or may not be qualified and willing to check the veracity of sources used.

*I think Wikipedia is probably not as quick to review changes now. Not so surprising since it's a publicly run page. They were soliciting donations at the top of every page a couple of days ago, and I think I remember reading about how they're struggling to keep up with server costs.

Sorry kj for hijacking your thread. Good luck with the tournament. Sounds like fun!

46Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:53 pm

kjdadada

kjdadada
Legend
Legend
it was all in good fun Skizzer. I know it was a pointless discussion, however, I've had much worse arguments. lol... ANason was great. Needed a smoke afterwards


_________________



2013

Season 5: Charlotte Checkers Captain
Season 6: New Jersey Devils G/RD
World Championship Admin | AHL Admin | Yanick Dupre Memorial Award (S5)

Thanks to KingFromTheDot for the sigs!

47Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:57 pm

ANason21


Veteran
Veteran
What do you mean WAS all in good fun? Does that mean we're done here?  Sad 


_________________
Season 7 PHL Vancouver Giants
Season 7 AHL Rockford Icehogs
Season 8 AHL Rochester Americans 'C'
Season 9 AHL Grand Rapids Griffins/NHL Detroit Redwings

48Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 6:16 pm

ChiTownMenace

ChiTownMenace
Veteran
Veteran
for fuck sake. 10 minutes of my life wasted skimming this waste of a thread. why oh why did i even bother reading this steaming pile of shit that no one cares about? Sad


_________________


S7: Calgary Hitmen/Charlotte Checkers/Asst. Capt. of Chicago Wolves Calder Cup Finalists
S8: Capt. of Portland Pirates, 1st Line West Conf. All Stars RW
S9: Capt. of Minnesota Wild - West Conf. All Stars RW Candidate
VGKHL S1: Owner of EV ZUG KHL Cup Finalist
VGKHL S2: Owner of Geneve-Servette
https://www.facebook.com/steve.houswerth

49Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Thu Dec 19, 2013 6:40 pm

B-Bunny


Legend
Legend
ChiTownMenace wrote:for fuck sake. 10 minutes of my life wasted skimming this waste of a thread. why oh why did i even bother reading this steaming pile of shit that no one cares about? Sad

Oh thanks, you saved me 10 minutes.

Continue on with this shit thread.

Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Didnt-read-lol-gif-11


_________________


Definition of a tournament - Page 2 VakcpG
Definition of a tournament - Page 2 8lbWG4P
----
[10:09:37 PM] valleybeast55982: bro to be a superstar u gotta carry the load, Its what #TedLindsay means
-----
[4:15:47 PM] fidel carrera: Bunny go Fuck yourself
[4:15:55 PM] fidel carrera: Enjoy being a Loser

-----
Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Wro089
http://www.CNHL-PS3.com

50Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Empty Re: Definition of a tournament on Fri Dec 20, 2013 12:52 pm

SNAKE_-_PLISSKIN

SNAKE_-_PLISSKIN
Superstar
Superstar
Maybe we could have avoided all this if it was called "Team Series Single Elimination Tournament".  Meaning when your team loses a series your team is out?????


_________________
Definition of a tournament - Page 2 Snake_12

Sponsored content


Back to top  Message [Page 2 of 3]

Go to page : Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum